Losing 'that sound' at volume. . . .

[me-and-my-shadow]

Since my days of regular gigs in the early 60s and using a Vox AC 30 I now use the humble but adequate Rowland Cube 60 (clean) together with a Boss ME 70.
Not intending to play other than in small surroundings, the Marvin sound I programmed for a mid range volume is absolutely fine...now I have a problem. Ive had cause to use more volume consequently the treble end is way too harsh. 'That sound' on my Boss is a balance between Bass, Mid(especially) and Treble combined with the right delay and modulation..if I turn down the treble on pedal or amp the overall tone/sound changes significantly. No matter what I try I lose 'that sound'. Basically I need to be able to turn up the volume without losing the smooth treble. Tricky one 'ain't it. Perhaps it means a complete re-set on the Boss which I dont relish .... any suggestions other than buy another amp ? John

[ecca]

Can't you mike it up John ?

[cockroach]

Often it's the reverse problem- turning volume DOWN causes the tone to change!

Remember that the Roland pre-amp etc will inevitably colour any sound from an external unit.

Are you using the Boss by way of effects loop in and out jacks on the Roland, or does it just get plugged straight into the Roland guitar input jack?

If not, try that first. An external graphic equaliser in the chain might also compensate for changes in tone at different volume levels using your setup.

[roger bayliss]

Likely that the harmonic content is changing with volume and probably odd harmonics getting louder and hence harsher tone in treble frequencies. This is probably due to solid state transistors and one of the reasons why valve amps are revered for their tone and smoothness as the even harmonics are more musical and pleasing to the ear. I think Ecca is making the best suggestion re miking as it is unlikely you will shift the harsh odd harmonics with any treble tone knob !

I have a transistor amp we use for our club nights which every one likes and uses and does not suffer with the harshness issue as it uses MOSFETs which are the nearest transistor equivalant to valves as far as musical harmonics and overtones go and when a friend demo it to me I realised the clean volume potential the amp had. I can turn it up all the way and still the tone is clean and not harsh and ideal for Shadows tunes. I am lucky to have it as it was put in a new birch ply cab and has a great Fender single eminence speaker in the enclosure.

So if it is a transistor based amp you want look for MOSFETs in specs

[ecca]

Don't all transistor amps use MOSFETS these days ?
Principally because they're bombproof.

[roger bayliss]

It would make good sense Ecca but I do not think all of them do ? Cannotfind any info on MOSFETs in Cube amp and specs do not give anything either

[cockroach]

I haven't used valve amps since the mid-'70's, but I have had quite a few transistor amps since then.

I didn't want to give an opinion on the Roland Cubes, as I didn't want to offend anyone, but two of my mates have Cubes, and I just don't like the sounds they produce...I read somewhere that the speaker enclosure is not a good size and volume etc, don't know if this is so(?)..I have a Marshall tranny job MG50DFX at present which I prefer soundwise. According to the hand book detail, the gain/volume control on the clean channel is designed to emulate the way a valve amp reacts when the volume is cranked, but I don't know if its a MOSFET job.

[me-and-my-shadow]

Many thanks for the replies here, looks like it will remain a problem for the time being... the setup is: guitar to Boss ME70 to standard top input socket on Roland amp.Clean channel. J

[cockroach]

John

If the Cube has an effects loop- try that first- put a patch lead from Cube pre-amp out to Boss effect input, then another patch cord from Boss output to Cube effects input.

[Iain Purdon]

Something like this came up in a thread about modelling amps some months ago and Martin Payne kindly pointed us to the link below. This isn't the same question but I found it a fascinating read anyway and, who knows, it may help towards finding an answer...

http://www.valvetronix.net/forums/how-to-get-great-tone-from-valvetronix-at-gigging-volume-t192.html