Correct Strings Yet Again (re flatwounds this time)

[abstamaria]

In doing research for correct strings for the early Ventures sound, I am told, and more or less convinced, that flatwounds (tapewound being the UK equivalent?) were the norm in the early 60s. A guitar dealer in the U.S. whose opinion I respect echoes this, thus:

"Flatwound strings were THE strings in the 50s and early 60s. This is what Fender, Gibson, Rickenbacher, Gretsch put on all their guitars. It wasn't until the mid 60s that round wound strings started being used. I was told that roundwounds were available maybe as early as the late 50s, but they were not really popular. It wasn't until Ernie Ball started marketing "Slinky's" that players and manufacturers changed from flatwounds."

As I mentioned in the other section (How to get the Ventures' sound), I will try flatwounds on my Jazzmaster for the Ventures sound. However, if what i quoted above is accurate, wouldn't the Shadows have started out with flatwounds too? Wouldn't Hank's (Cliff's) Strat have been delivered from the U.S. with flatwounds? And probably also the subsequent set of Jenning's-supplied Strats? Or was the siruation different in England?

According to the book "That Sound,'' all the Shadows early hits were played on a Gretsch with tapewound strings! Well, perhaps not on a Gretsch, but with flatwound strings maybe?

Many thanks for any guidance here.

Andy

[Didier]

Hi Andy,

In the early sixties, I remember well than when I looked at Fender Strats in Paris' music shops, they were always fitted with flatwound strings. But I could only look at them, I didn't had enough money to buy one !
I have friends who play Shadows' music with D'Addario ECG25 12-52 flatwound strings.

Didier

[roger bayliss]

I thought it was known that HBM had used Gibson Sonomatics for most of the early stuff. If flatwound /tapewound are good for cutting string noise there is a bit of string noise just after the solo part in Frightened City before he does the high part second time so that might give us a clue ?

[JimN]

Just to be clear on the issue of Gibson Sonomatics...

In about 1966/67, Bruce Welch answered a reader's query in the Melody Maker's "Any Questions?" column on the subject of strings and other related matters. Bruce's answer was something like: "The Shadows use Gibson Sonomatic strings on all their guitars". That would presumably have included the acoustic J-45s they then had as well as on the Burns electrics.

Although there is absolutely no reason to doubt Bruce's answer and every reason to accept it, it isn't the same as his saying "We used Gibson Sonomatics on Apache". Over the years, Hank has given various answers on the question of what strings he has used, including the E340 Sonomatics (E340L Sonomatic light gauge in the late sixties and early seventies), D'Addario, Ernie Ball and DR. They're just the ones I can remember.

A more recent quote from Bruce (and I can't remember where I heard it - but I did hear it rather than read it) was that the Shads use whatever strings they can get for free, which seems a reasonable enough stance. Any of us would do the same if we could.

Remembering also that when Cliff ordered the original Strat from the States, he asked for "a spare set of Fender balanced strings" with it, my guess is that the Sonomatics were part of a mid-sixties deal with Selmer, possibly connected with the J-45 / B-45 purchases.

This allows that various brands (in essence, whatever was available) may have used before the Shads got a deal on strings. This may well have included Fender Mastersound, Black Diamond (Buddy Holly used those!), Monopole... anything, really. But they'll have been fairly heavy by today's standards. At the time, all guitar strings were.

HTH,

JN

[chas]

My recollection of strings in the early 60's was that although there were plenty of flatwounds around, plenty of new guitars came with roundwound, and I'm positive all the Fenders I saw (and occassionally tried) had roundwound. However, not the case with basses - they certainly came with flatwounds, and the first I came across with roundwound was a Danelectro long horn bass (1965), which I bought shortly after John Entwhistle showed and played one to me, and a few months later (1966 by then) I discovered Rotosound were producing some roundwound bass strings (and I got the impression that they were new out, though I could be wrong), which I bought to fit to my newly aquired used Precision Bass.

Chas.

[cockroach]

I can remember a trip to London to the West End music shops which my old mate on this site (Keith Bateman) and I made in late 1962/early 1963

If he reads this, he may confirm my memory!

We were only about 13 years old and we begged the shop assistant chap to let us take two new dream guitars out of the glass display case...a Fiesta red rosewood board Strat, and a sunburst Fender Bass VI (i.e. Hank and Jet's models) We were ecstatic and wet our pants....

They both had FLATWOUND strings- probably Fender original equipment.

My new Hofner Club 40 in early 1965 had flatwounds, as did my new Elite (Italian made 335 style, also sold as a Vox) in 1966. They were all heavy gauge then, of course- about 13-56

Inevitably, when us young hard-up teenage lads had to replace the original worn or broken flatwound strings, we bought the far cheaper roundwounds.

I went over to the 1-1-2-3-4-5 'understrung' do- it -yourself light gauge slinky stringing by buying individual strings to make a set, in about July/August 1965, just before I joined my first group. I wanted to play Rolling Stones stuff, not Shadows that that time...

By about late 1966/early 1967, Rotosound(UK), La Bella and Esquier(USA) light gauge sets with unwound thirds became available in the shops...

[Keith Bateman]

I remember those days well John but not the specifics of how the guitars were strung. I do remember that flatwounds seemed to be the norm at that time though and I certainly had them on my top-of-the-range Rosetti Solid 7!

Keith

[ecca]

"I went over to the 1-1-2-3-4-5 'understrung' do- it -yourself light gauge slinky stringing by buying individual strings to make a set, in about July/August 1965, just before I joined my first group. I wanted to play Rolling Stones stuff, not Shadows that that time..."

What was the set with an extra first string ?
That was the answer to our prayers.
Happy days.

[RayL]

A while ago, someone gave me an original unused pack of 1960s Vox strings. This is a plastic wallet labelled Phantom Guitar Strings by VOX. The inside includes a liner card with a pic of Cliff and The Shadows and the words 'Top artists choose Vox strings. Endorsed by Cliff Richard and The Shadows'. The Shadows shown (L to R) are Bruce, Tony, Jet and Hank. That places the date of these strings as being in the very early 60s, yet not only are the strings wirewound, but they are quite light guage. Since other Vox advertising was careful to keep up with the changes to The Shadows personnel , it is reasonable to say that it is probably not an out-of-date picture being used.

Measured with a digital micrometer (and allowing for the corrosion that has left them with a rough surface), the set is 11, 16 , 27(w), 35 (w), 42 (w) and 46 (w).

So if anyone (Jim N.?) knows when The Shads started endorsing Vox strings (British Made!), then certainly from that time they had access to light-guage wirewound strings.

Ray

[JimN]

Ray,

The "Phantom" designation clearly refers to the famous Vox solid guitar of that name.

Rotosound (James How and Co) made the actual strings, of course, just as they made strings for Burns, one set of which was also named after a Burns solid guitar: the Bison.

Both guitar companies made a point of selling "light gauge" strings as part of their range, but this may have been prompted by James How, who sold his own "light" set: "Power King", which started at an 0.0011" string. They were popular in the days just before the explosion of the "slinky" 10-46 set (that didn't happen until 1967, when Ernie Ball were starting to be influential and tales were circulated about "staggered stringing" and Clifford Essex banjo strings).

The above being so, your strings - or at least, the packet - cannot be from earlier than 1962, when the Phantom was first introduced and adopted by the Jaywalkers. It follows that the endorsement picture of the Shadows must be out of date, since Tony had left in October 1961. I think it also likely that it postdates Jet's departure, since the Phantom was available only later in 1962.

It's a puzzle...

JN