EARLY SHADS AMPS IN DISCOGRAPHY ORDER??

[Gary Allen]

Regarding the early amps..Would there be any reason why Hank favoured the jmi top boost rather than the 30/4 for the current tour. Would there be a difference in sound ?....Gary

[MeBHank]

So - if this is true - where does the much heralded original AC15 , the HolyGrail (supposedly) of Shads amps sit in all this?? If Apache onwards was the AC30/4, when, if ever, did the AC15 feature in recordings.
The reason for my interest is that using the AC15 model, I CANNOT get the sound I think I am looking for BUT to use the AC30 model, back off the treble and select 1 x 12 Vox speakercab, I get what I think is a better tone. I know all this is subjective though - hence my interest.

Ian, the Holy Grail is achievable with both amps, either the circuit three AC15 (as you heard a month ago) or the AC30/4, as Amanda and Alan concur. The two amps are identical circuit-wise apart from the power stage. I agree with Alan in that the bigger cabinet and the two speakers will help boost the bottom end soightly (oo err, missus!). Phil and I have the luxury of having both types of amp available to us, and we have agreed after various experiments and tests that it was most likely the two speaker AC30/4 with Rola G12 speakers used on Apache. It matched the sound exactly (bar room ambience), and we think it likely that the same model of amp was used on many of the hits recorded after that point. It would make sense if Apache was the 30/4, as those amps were made in 1959 and were distributed comercially in 1960.

Before they started recording the big instrumetals, Hank famously preferred the sound of Vox amps to the Fender and I suspect that he was using the circuit two AC15 at that time. Then Dick developed his masterpiece: the third Vox circuit. The Shads never used the circuit three AC15s, though - they went straight to the single speaker version of the AC30/4.

Justin, on the early Cliff shows, the AC15's can clearly be seen mic'd at the front.

There is video footage showing both front and back miking at different times. But, front or back, it doesn't matter. I believe Bruce; what he says makes sense, that they used the AC15s for TV gigs after the AC30/4s were available as they were easier to transport to the studios, and the "in-house" volume/mix was not important on those occasions.

I'm enjoying this thread, it's good fun!

J

[Stratpicker]

So am I, Justin. This is how discussions and debates should go - exchange of views and info without resorting to hand grenades!!
I suspect that the "model" AC30 in my Ampworks is more AC30 Top Boost than AC30/4, so that is why I get too brittle a sound.
I have to say that the sound of your AC15 at Exeter was just marvellous and I've been playing with my Modeller ever since to try and get that tone without much success!!
cheers
ian

[MeBHank]

You're very kind, Ian. I'm very pleased with it.

If you modeller is made by Vox, when it says it will get you the sound of an AC30 it really means "Top-Boost". These units won't be able to replicate the sounds of the actual circuits we would like. As you've probably deduced, he best thing you can do is use the closest approximation you can.

J

[Gary Allen]

I ve just read on Charlies site that Hanks jmi amps are not the top boost models if anyone wants to know....Gary

[ecca]

It only requires a slight difference in amp volume for the character of the sound to change considerably.
All of this " that sound " business is nonsense.
Which record ? How loud ? Where was the microphone ? blah blah.

[MeBHank]

I ve just read on Charlies site that Hanks jmi amps are not the top boost models if anyone wants to know....Gary

That's correct, Gary. Thankfully, Hank is back to using circuit three amplifiers, and I've heard he's using the vintage setting on the TVS3! Now the only real difference in his live sound compared to the vintage sound is the way that he plays.

J

[Gary Allen]

Has anyone got the same meazzi unit that Hank used (drum or wheel).I know theres a few modified tape units but are they modded to the same spec on the records or are they just close.Im surprised theres no demo s floating around...I know phil did the youtube thing but are there any soundfiles with a meazzi on it.?....Gary

[roger bayliss]

So am I, Justin. This is how discussions and debates should go - exchange of views and info without resorting to hand grenades!!
I suspect that the "model" AC30 in my Ampworks is more AC30 Top Boost than AC30/4, so that is why I get too brittle a sound.
I have to say that the sound of your AC15 at Exeter was just marvellous and I've been playing with my Modeller ever since to try and get that tone without much success!!
cheers
ian

Ian try using the AC15 model with a twin speaker cab model that should mimic an AC30/4 but also need to understand how to use the tone controls on these modellers as often they have some quirks ... HTH

[MeBHank]

Has anyone got the same meazzi unit that Hank used (drum or wheel).I know theres a few modified tape units but are they modded to the same spec on the records or are they just close.Im surprised theres no demo s floating around...I know phil did the youtube thing but are there any soundfiles with a meazzi on it.?....Gary

Gary, I hope to get some recordings done soon. Ish. I'll of course be using all my vintage gear, including my Meazzi, at the Children in Need gig in Reading, if you can make it.

Regarding the drum Meazzi, yes, at least one is still in existance. Firstly, it is rumoured Hank still owns his original Model 2 unit, but this is unconfirmed. There is one more, though. Alan Jackson owns it, but it has not been heard as the restoration job has taken a rather long time, I believe. Patrice Bastien has modded the circuit of a Binson drum unit to match the Meazzi perfectly and by all accounts the sound is superb, although no sound files have emerged as yet.

The Meazzis Phil, Colin and I all use are slightly different: we have had modifications done to suit our individual requirements. They are very close to the circuit of the original drum units, but any difference is minimal. There is hardly any difference in sound between tape and drum, if any. After all, once the oxide wore off Hank's echo, he put a length of 1/4" tape around the drum anyway, so the echo signal on many of the recordings we hear will actually be transported by tape anyway!

HTH...

J